Asserting our boundaries is difficult, but it IS compassionate. We need to know ourselves –especially our limits — in order to have healthy relationships with others. Knowing when something is too much, and saying so, makes everyone happier; in a healthy relationship we should want to know what is really going through our partner (of whatever kind)’s mind, and not be taking things past their comfort. Sometimes compassion is saying ‘I know this is important to you but I can’t because…’

I hate to say something absolute, because everyone, big or small, is at a different point on their journey. But change is constant, and with each new experience comes some new learning about people and the reality surrounding them. Boundaries are set based on instinct, or at least some version of a process that happens so quickly we hardly have time to think it through. But with each new experience, a small change to this process occurs. How can you know where the boundary lies if you have never crossed it? Thank you for the insight this question poses, I very much enjoyed it.

‎”…if you haven’t found it yet, keep looking. Don’t settle. As with all matters of the heart, you’ll know when you find it.” -Steve Jobs

Three words: Detachment, compassion and love. Detach from the things that do not serve your highest self. This is where creating boundaries for myself begins. Be compassionate for the things you are fetching from and then send love to all. I am lobe, truth and beauty.

Timely questions, Brendan, as I’ve also been pondering the ideas of boundaries, primarily from the point of view that we often fail to set them in fear of hurting the feelings of other people. Of course, more often than not, this leads to our own unhappiness and discomfort. I often hesitate to move my emotional line towards others, worrying that they will feel I am encroaching upon them, as well as I allow others to overstep too far into my own space as I don’t want them to feel rejected.

Slowly, though, I am finding the baby bear zone of “just right” and it comes from first honouring myself. As I can not control how others will react by my (in)actions, I must first look to my own comfort, as long as I am not intentionally causing harm.

I am finding it easier, though, to push back the boundaries set by others (and allowed by me) than I am to do a bit of pushing myself. By keeping a tighter bubble around myself I am limiting my experiences. The rational part of me recognizes this. The emotional part of me just has to be willing to accept if someone else doesn’t welcome my expansion into their life, it is probably more about them, and not about me.

Compassion can be infinite, but when boundaries are crossed you can feel it. Even if it doesn’t affect you right now, when you see a necessary boundary being crossed, and you know you are going to be in need later, the feeling of compassion comes simultaneously to this feeling. Because when we show ourselves compassion in every moment, be it for your bodies or our dreams, we know how to be compassionate for others, which borders are necessary and which are self-constructed. In the end all self-constructed borders trap us within ourselves, but compassion for ourselves allows us to travel amongst those we feel compassion for.

In that vesica pisces you have the creation of the generative roots and the fuel for all further development. If people click like that, then you might say that their relation is one of a proportion that has no need of regulation. It will accord.
In the event of having a question I am really stuck with I tend to just hold it in awareness and go and take time in the world relating to it freely and yet seeing how it relates to whatever the question is, thi generally informs me of my own ‘boundary’ when there is one. “There is no greater work than a work with no purpose, No greater Love than a Love with no object” and most probably no greater life than one lived boundless.

Answering your questions is pretty difficult since (obviously) I don’t know you nor do I really know how you define these concepts.

Short statement: It all comes down to two things: knowing and loving yourself. Everything else is secondary. There are so many concepts interwoven with the topics you addressed.

Setting boundaries is often motivated by the urge underneath to prevent pain and fear. I’d just say the key thing is very likely to try and keep your heart or soul accessible, even in pain.
Don’t try to avoid pain – accept both pain and joy merely as varieties of life. This may seem like stating the obvious but when we look at several religions, they all seem to state: Here is love, there is pain, fear, hate etc. – stay away from pain and renounce the dark side, since your already conveniently know what love is. I would say, don’t be afraid to look down the abyss, and accept it too.
So if you really let your protective layers down in this process of self-development, you’ll have insights and experiences as never before but it will also possibly mean the pain I talked about. Take that as opportunities to learn.

Hm, what is compassion exactly? To me (I am not a native speaker of English) compassion is similar to charity or to what the ancient greeks called “Agape”, that is the fundamental love to your fellow humans in general and, with that, probably forbearingness towards people. These are qualities that are surely important. Still, don’t focus too much on compassion itself, since that only develops (and completely naturally in my opinion) where the individual has learned to love themselves. So this first step will actually be the more important one. Spent time with yourself, get to know yourself.

I find that image of the intertwining rings you posted very much to the point. It’s true, knowing yourself involves being mirrored by and sharing with others. And I am convinced we always meet exactly those people that have the capacity to make us realise or know something, for better or worse. Only then we can set boundaries, tentatively, as we get to know our inner self better. This also touches its counterpart, letting yourself be seen wholly. With all your light and dark sides still allowing your people to see you as you are. I guess the golden path is in between. No definitive answer again.

How to combine compassion and setting boundaries in relationships? I’m afraid this is a highly individual question and can only be discovered by yourself. My music teacher is in her mid-70s and is still about to discover that. Relationships are always asymmetrical to some extent. Therefore it will always be a back and forth setting your boundaries or likewise accepting or trespassing the other person’s boundaries.
I also think it is good to realise that we all have to go the path on our own, but we are still connected to everyone else. This apparent paradox creates the wonderful energies that sent you high or low and will probably inspire your music (your music, which I really appreciate!). So you have that great means of channeling the depths of your soul into your music – go and take the journey. Be fearless.

Your question “how do you know which? is what? for when? for who?” is perhaps too specific for this basic issue. The way I personally set boundaries and practice compassion (or struggle with that) might not be helpful for you at all. I am sorry, experiences simply cannot be passed on, or prevented for that matter. If you have managed the first part, the rest will follow. You know the famous saying “When the student is ready, the teacher [aka the lesson] will appear”. So don’t be too impatient. Be kind to yourself, which is perhaps in itself difficult because people tend to confuse self-love with narcism and are ashamed to be good to themselves.

Perhaps there is one thing I would like to suggest to you from my experience. Try to do stuff that you are afraid of!

Boundaries and real compassion are pretty directly connected to wisdom, which is only gained and earned through experiencing and observing in real time. There is no way to tell where boundaries should lie or bend, because they don’t actually exist. Everything is relative to the person contemplating these things… It is only after we have lost everything that we are free to do anything.

Please be safe…

M.

Compassion is the ability to connect to someone else’s experiences, in other words to show empathy. To truly share the often painful experiences of another person we open ourselves to discomfort. This is where boundaries come in. We must first know our dark places and let fear soften us (not harm us) and then reach out to the shared ground and truly connect. Bringing our honest and authentic selves to the table. But at this point we do not become enmeshed, entangled. Being authentic means having boundaries, being present with someone implies we have boundarie; This is how i understand it.

WE ARE MONKEYS, ROBOTS, AND ANGELS ALL AT ONCE. WE MUST BALANCE THESE REALMS. IF YOU LOSE ONE OF THESE REALMS, YOU BECOME SOMETHING ELSE. IT’S OK TO HAVE ‘PREFERENCES,’ IF YOU LOSE THEM YOU HAVE BECOME SUB- OR SUPER-HUMAN

Compassion is limitless and cannot be confined by boundaries. When we are concerned with boundaries there is a need to practice compassion for ourselves and/or for others. When acting from a place of compassion we are able to take the right action because we have the wise insight compassion bestows upon us. The compassion building practice I use “on the go” when I do not have time to sit in a temple, forest, my bedroom and am engaged in a conversation with someone, or am walking through a city street, is called Tonglen. It’s a tool from the Shambala tradition described here: http://www.shambhala.org/teachers/pema/tonglen1.php It is a breathing practice that reverses the intuitive “breathe in the positive and exhale the pain”. Instead, it focuses on the practitioner as the crucible in which suffering and confusion are transmuted to compassion.

You had me at Vesica Piscis ;-)
Where we meet in the middle is where we have compassion for the other and ourselves. Who has access to us is a learned response through beliefs and experiences in my humble opinion – it’s like if a client or friend of mine says “I keep ending up with the same dynamic in my romantic relationships”… well, I feel that’s because they’re acting out a lesson of compassion for an experience that they will not accept in themselves or from their past.

Astrologists who are really on their game will address this and I love it when they do, I just posted about this very thing yesterday:

‎”The inevitable truth of partnership is that it will grow us up and evolve us into more individuated beings in one way or another. It will force us to examine more of who we are.”

Blunt and empowering is also a way to approach love (especially self-love). http://www.realitysandwich.com/star_crossed_lovers

If we stay stuck in a pattern, are we not limiting our expansion? Are we not unconsciously revolving within the labyrinth boundaries of our own fear?

Meh, I could go on but I think a key ingredient to swim in regarding boundaries and compassion is acknowledging the self, your relationship to all of our own personal aspects that we deny or judge or welcome. Dig it?

Balance is not something that is easily seen. It is almost as if you have to have a sense for it. The only way to build up a sense of balance between two things, such as compassion and boundary, is to live life, accept the lessons that come to you and take them to heart.

There is nothing in this world that is more important than balance, and everybody has a different center of balance than the next person.

There really is no one answer to this question, yet the fact that one would ask means that they are in the process of learning a lesson that will contribute to their answer, which will not be something explainable with words, but rather, with actions.

Just wanted to say thank you all for taking the time to respond so fully and honestly. I’m currently in Europe (experiencing some serious things) but will respond here as soon as I have a decent amount of time to write back. For the time being please follow my facebook page where ive been updating from my phone about the riots I witnessed in Athens and my feelings since – http://www.facebook.com/ESKMO
best
b

I can’t even describe what I want to say… I love you

not really sure. other people’s feeling are very hard to gauge, so I try not to generalize between people. i have know people that have been extremely open with me and i never talk about myself, or the other way around. I just make it up as I go along, try and identify what is the best for an encounter. for instance, I don’t mind getting personal with people I probably will never meet again, but find it harder with people I am around all the time. This kind of stuff for sure depends on your own mind though; why it can be so different from person to person.

Know what you want in life. Put up boundaries between things that will inhibit you from attaining your goals. Break down boundaries that are already doing the same. Don’t make walls or burn bridges that you will need to cross again later.

Also, come back to Knoxville.

In my experience, the key to finding balance here is threefold: honesty, fluidity, and group-centered consciousness. Honesty provides genuine interaction that roots out the needs that form the boundaries. Fluidity gives honesty power by recognizing that our needs are not static. Group-centered consciousness casts the self and the the people around you as cospirators (opposite of conspirators) in the creation of your environment.

All three of these are vital to setting healthy and compassionate boundaries for ourselves and others, because stringency in boundaries blocks compassion and it blocks growth. Ultimately we have to realize our own boundaries are ephemeral, made of materials that in the healthy, evolving individual will be shrugged off with the next lesson.

But we can’t expect this of others or even ourselves, because expectation is a breeding ground for discontent. Practice gratitude when you begin to feel the sting of entitlement. To look at yourself and those around you as learning creatures who need patience and understanding is to transcend boundaries and realize the humanity that lies behind.

Thanks for starting this conversation, and I love your music!!

i’ve been going through similar explorations. through the last year of darkness only one thing has returned me to the light:

do what you want and do it it for you.

don’t worry about how your boundaries look to others. you’ll find that if you direct all of your love and compassion inward and commit completely to what your intuition is telling you, it will naturally be reflected externally. the world is a mirror and it will see your passion. at times you will have to destroy something or initiate conflict, which may feel negative. but true change, progression, and new life comes out of the death of what existed before.

another lesson I’ve learned on boundaries is to set a firm outer boundary so you can have a peaceful sacred place inside yourself and be able to discern who joins you there. at the same time i’ve been learning to break down my inner boundary so that when i choose to let someone in, they get all of me. all the dark shadows and all of the radiant fire.

i really feel the depth of your experiences in your music. it is a wonderful inspiration.

much ♥

i also wanted to recognize what julianne suggested: do what you fear the most, the truth loves to hide behind tooth and nail.

and what agape theon mentioned: when pain and contraction grips you, hug it back. feel it fully and be fascinated by the sensations.

hey everyone, I’ve really enjoyed reading your responses to this question :) This has been at the forefront of my daily life for just over a year now, and I’ve had some intense experiences that arrived at just the right time, and that have helped me to understand how I was manifesting compassion and boundaries in my life.

When I first read Brendan’s post, the experiences I’ve had suddenly connected themselves to my favorite book. The Neverending Story. I’ve been reading this book for nearly 20 years now, sometimes as often as once a year. I always find something new, something that relates in unexpected ways with what’s going on for me in that moment.

In the book, a boy named Atreyu is sent on a quest to cure the Childlike Empress of her sickness, and in so doing save Fantasia(written as Fantastica in the english translation), the realm of human dreams and imagination. His only hope is to address Uyulala, the Southern Oracle, a voice with no body that speaks in rhymes, and may only be addressed in rhyme. Her wisdom is infinite, but our hero must pass through 3 magic gates to reach her. The first gate, The Great Riddle Gate, is guarded by two Sphinxes. Within their gaze all the riddles of the universe flow, so to pass through, the Sphinxes must close their eyes for you, or you will be paralyzed – frozen in place, solving all the riddles of the universe until your body wastes away and you die. I passed through that gate one sunny morning in July of 2008, while listening to music on my headphones in my apartment in Japan. A strange fear that had been binding me dropped away.

The second gate is the Magic Mirror Gate. It is not made of glass or metal. It shows you your true nature, and so it is a very difficult gate to pass through. Some people yelp with horror and run away screaming from the creature they see. But to pass through, you must step into what you see in the mirror. This past summer I stared full upon myself and felt the arrogant, dominating, greedy and vain parts of myself emerge. I realized how that self had been coloring my interactions with the people nearest and dearest to me, dressing itself up as loving concern.

That creature I saw, it needed my compassion desperately. It had been ignored for so long. An embarrassment shoved to the back of the junk drawer. I walked into it, embraced it and shared it with the people I love. The creature still tries to co-opt my circuits sometimes, but now I can feel it, and can work with it instead of against it. That creature is all about judgement, comparison, drawing lines(boundaries), setting definitions of who people are and what is possible. Recently, my thoughts have shifted from compassion and boundaries, to the meaning and practice of discernment, and loving with detachment.

So now I approach the final gate, behind which the open air palace of the Song that is Uyulala awaits. The No-Key Gate. A gate with no handle, no doorknob, no key-hole. It is made of an indestructible material that responds only to your will. Paradoxically, it is the will that makes it indestructible and unmovable, and it will only open for someone who forgets all purpose, who wants nothing at all…. wish me luck!

xoxo

Kanose M.

Eskmo… Brendon… I am just a Denver Fan and driver (red rocks wink wink) I got and thought the big ??? I read some of the response… (Julianne has some depth) but the ??? is probly changing maybe unanswerable… (i mean.. who what where???) I can know thatCOMPASSION is a positive+ and spreads positively+ vs or the same as negative-… creativity is also positive+ on a link to understanding in ANY one, prespective or view or relationship. BOUNDRIES are a changing constant… I suppose only that you can only have compassion give compassion want compassion… I suppose boundries are only broke percieved changed or surpassed by your own abilty or imporatantly your creative ability to have give and want compassion…. huh… Hey Welder…. I only responded to your ??? because…. here it is… I did witness your incredable awesome and moving preformance right here in Denver…. and did feel just excatly like my boundies were changed opened embraced…. Im not sure what it was… mabybe the snow shovel or maybe it was the beautiful Unified rainbow that I saw surrounding you in that incredable Alex Grey show, whatever it was which ever is was. I really think that is the way…
My advice… dont stop giving that awesome creativity and genuine showmanship…. if you are surrounded by eastern block asses european forieners wild damn dogs friendly or not… come back… come back… you have friends fans compassion boundry breaking blessings right here… come back to Alex… Jamie and the less much less know Octopus and of coarse the growing fans… We get it…. WE WANT MORE MORE MORE MORE MORE……. Sincerely, Sincerely, Sincerely… Angela Bauer

They are the stretching of one’s limitations to allow for the magnanimity of the human spirit to transpire.
They are the polls between which love and loss converge, erecting a butterfly net for one’s greatest potential.
They -construct, dissolve, construct, dissolve- who we ARE, refining our being with every experiential ebb and flow.
They are to be revered not feared as the propellers across the deep waters we tread.

Each of us working with what we have, we are to be astute students of ourselves and the mystery…… Courageously, gracefully, humbly
This is the nobility of the human spirit

Compassion and moral integrity (or knowing the difference between supposed “right” and “wrong”) are often confused with one another. Your moral’s are formed through how you are “taught” to perceive the world, and are actually stored in a very specific location in the brain called the right temporo parietal junction. For example……If you have been taught your whole life that a certain race of people is inferior to your own would you want to help a person of that race if they were in trouble….most likely not. But true compassion sees through ignorant moral boundaries and recognizes that life is life regardless of color/shape/size/species etc. Hurting others only hurts yourself, quite literally. Western religion try’s to squeeze and manipulate its believers into the ideology that we are all separate, even at the most fundamental level, and that the choices each individual makes effects how the rest of their life/death/after death is determined. But we have learned learned that everything effects everything else, which is described in great detail in quantum mechanics, buddhism philosphy, and also hinduism. But at the same time take into account the fact that everything youve ever learned….ever….can have its origins traced back to another person with probably less knowledge about the world than you currently have, then you understand that what we perceive as right and wrong is constantly being manipulated by our intake of knowledge, senses, environment etc. There always seems to be a fundamental level of compassion that everyone has, one which requires no intellectual input to be formed or understood. We become aware of this level of compassion every time we come in contact with life, wether at its most basic levels or the most advanced. Because we see ourselves. Sometimes it takes true experiences of pain and suffering to have and understand the highest levels of compassion and happiness.

sometimes i think im here to cross my boundaries…i tried to find them, define them, catch something that specify form of my existence…usually beyond my boundaries there is no place for compassion…unless for myself…
S.

As taught by The Dali Lama, “Love & compassion are necessities, not luxuries. Without them, humanity cannot survive.”

Considering compassion & boundaries as both the same within love, we feel it every time we express ourselves as that is who we are.

It is what it is. When we experience this love, all we can do is embrace the moment & all that comes with it.

Whether it be compassion or a boundary that we share, in the end, it is a choice that we make to choose whether the lesson itself is or is not received by what is being presented.

Positive & Negative, Yes & No, 1′s & 0′s, Black & White… It’s all Cause & Effect.

We as spirits make that choice to create change.

Our compassion is the boundary that’s set when we share it with the world.

=)

Honour yourself first. ;)

It it sort of a deeper concept that I want to illustrate, but I’ll do my best – boundaries imo are best communicated as dynamic requests … for example, my need for space right now might be very different than my need for space at other times, and only by deep listening to my own needs can I keep in touch with what sort of boundaries I need to have in place. Setting them up between myself and other VIA request, rather than demand, is key, because it empowers the other to recognize my vulnerability (that I actually need something) and have the opportunity to take care of me in that. It is hard work to be so vulnerable – not only openly exposing my need, but also giving the other an option to take care of me or not – but the work is well worth the effort and you might be surprised with how much others genuinely enjoy taking care of you when they can really feel what’s going on for you inside.

The flipside of that, compassion, is taking care of others’ needs while simultaneously being mindful of your own (and I do think they’re best managed in that order). It seems your question is about negotiating healthy interdependence. I’ve found that by the deep listening to myself that I mentioned above, I’ve learned how to recognize others’ needs, even when they aren’t being totally open about them, and more often than not, the people I’ve interacted with can sense that I recognize them and am choosing to be warm and accepting of their vulnerability (aka compassionate). When I give others that respect*, often times I’ve found that further action (which may require sacrifice of getting my own needs met in the moment) isn’t even necessary – acknowledgement and respect are enough. To give an example, because that just got pretty abstract :P let’s say a classmate starts unloading about their rough night just before I’m about to head out to lunch because I’m very hungry. I can see they’re very stressed and probably needing some support. By looking them in the eye with my chest open to them and smiling, perhaps touching them on the arm and telling them, “I really want to be more present for you in this and I also need to go feed myself”, then the request (important!), “Do you mind if I go out and grab a bite?” and waiting for them to consent … I’ve rarely gotten a bad response! They can feel my real love for them and my real love for myself, and it inspires both confidence and respect – compassion and boundary.

This is all practice taken from Nonviolent Communication, by the way, should you want to look it up.

*a note on Respect: a Buddhist monk once told me about respect being “re-spect”, that is “to see again”. To notice someone, and then, to look again, and really see them the second time. Maybe you know what I mean. It is sacred and most people recognize it when it’s being offered.

Do let me know if you would be up for discussing some time ~

Peace,
Belen